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My week of non-traditional publishing alternatives (as I am now calling self & indie publishing from now on) is coming to a close. Michelle Davidson Argyle is a name you’ve heard on the blog before. She’s the artist behind my awesome Glass Cases banner, and designed the covers of Tracy Marchini’s self-published titles. Michelle is also a writer of contemporary and literary fiction, and fantasy. Having started with self-publishing, she moved on to indie with Rhemalda (which Karen Amanda Hooper told us all about yesterday!).
Tell me about Cinders. What made you decide to self-publish it?
I wrote Cinders at a time when I was really frustrated with publishing and writing. I had quit my blog at the time and decided I wanted to write something just for me with no restraints, no goals, really, except to entertain myself. Cinders started as a short story and then grew into a novella. Halfway through writing it I decided I would self-publish it because as a contributor of The Literary Lab blog, we had a lot of readers asking us about self-publishing – and we really didn’t know what to tell them.
So in a lot of ways, I wrote Cinders to self-publish it. I knew it stood a very small chance of making it traditionally. Agents don’t often look at novellas, especially as a debut piece, and publishers don’t see them as huge money-makers, either, so self-publishing seemed like a natural decision for the book. I am a photographer and love to design things, so the cover was a shoe-in, as well. I had a lot to learn, but the path has been a great one. At the time I published Cinders, I never intended to self-publish other works (and I haven’t so far, although I do have plans for a short story collection).
Did you query agents before deciding to self-publish? If so, how many/for how long?
I queried exactly two agents before self-publishing, but that was two years before I self-published, and I wasn’t very serious about it. I queried an agent at the Andrea Brown Literary Agency and Nathan Bransford, both for my contemporary YA novel, The Breakaway, which is now coming out with Rhemalda Pubilshing in 2012.
I’m embarrassed when I look back on those two queries. They were terribly done. I didn’t know what I was doing, and the book was far from ready. I knew that, too, and quickly changed my strategy to strengthening my writing. I knew it would be a few years before I was ready to publish.
What self-publishing service did you use?
I used CreateSpace.
Did you have to pay for their services?
My experience has been excellent with CreateSpace. Their quality is decent and their process is easy to use. CreateSpace is completely free unless you want to use their Pro Plan, which currently costs $39.00 up front and is $5.00 a year after that on each title. The Pro Plan gives you a larger royalty and brings the cost of your book way down. It was worth getting, at least for me. I think CreateSpace also offers services like editing and cover design and marketing for a fee. I didn’t use any of those services.
If I were to self-publish all my work exclusively, however, I would go with Lightning Source. They are a better fit for a long-term self-publishing career, and many small publishers (and even larger publishers for backlist titles, I’ve heard) use them.
Did you use outside editors for your work before self-publishing?
I contemplated hiring an editor for Cinders, but found out that one of my writing acquaintances online used to work as an editor. She volunteered to edit Cinders at no cost. She did an excellent job. I also put the book through extensive copyediting and several rounds of readers I’ve learned to trust and work well with over the years.
What did you do to publicize your book? How do you reach your target audience?
I gave away a lot of free books (print and ebook) as part of my blog tour, which lasted for one week when the book released. I’ve held contests, done interviews, and had a small launch party in my home. Reaching my target audience has been difficult, honestly. A lot of readers assume the book is young adult, but it’s more literary adult fantasy than anything else. For this reason the book has received some nasty reviews and misunderstanding because readers expected something completely different (namely a Disney fairy tale). I’m fine with that, but it’s made me think a lot about target audiences and book presentation.
Can you give a picture of how it sold? What percentage of royalties did you receive?
I receive 70% royalties on ebook Kindle copies sold through Amazon (in the U.S.) and a varying amount on print copies. CreateSpace charges a set fee on each sale depending on the page count, plus they take 40% of the list price. I currently have Cinders for sale at $6.99 for the print copy. This means I make $1.14 per sale on the U.S. site, but I have altered the price several times, so that amount has changed since I first released the book.
To date, I’ve sold 520 copies of Cinders in 14 months and made approximately $1,300. This includes all sales, including by-hand print book sales, ebook sales, and online print book sales through all channels. However, I’ve spent approximately $1,600 on the book (buying print copies, shipping free copies out, printing bookmarks, business cards, throwing a launch party, paying for the cover, the list goes on and on), so I haven’t actually made anything on the book yet.
To be completely honest, some days the amount of books I’ve sold seems high, some days extremely low. For my first book, however, and considering the true genre and that I’ve only barely released my second novel through a publisher, I’m happy with how it has sold so far.
Were there any unexpected challenges in self-publishing, things you didn’t expect would be so hard?
The emotional rollercoaster, mostly. The stigma against self-publishing (and yes, I believe there is currently still a stigma and there always will be a stigma to some degree) made it hard for me to feel on the same level in my own circle of author friends who were going with agents and getting huge deals and hitting bestseller lists and all that jazz. I felt very small and very different and it was hard for me to get used to the fact that I’d only sell a few copies of my book a week when other self-published and traditionally published authors were reporting about selling hundreds a week. What was wrong with my book? The cover was professional, the writing phenomenal, the reviews high, and I was pushing it at a steady pace. Still, I think when I realized how hard it is to self-publish a book, market a book, and keep writing books at the same time, I knew self-publishing wasn’t for me. I needed someone backing me up, rooting me on, and helping me market, even if just a little. It might be awful to say I need that validation from a publisher, too, but it’s true.
In all honesty, I’m not cut out to run my own business entirely by myself (I’m not sure many authors are). It was too much to do and too emotionally draining. Traditional publishing has been just as much work, but I have a wonderful publisher who acts as a safety net, a friend, and a financial supporter of my work. It makes all the difference to me.
What advice would you give writers who are considering self-publishing their work?
Understand that self-publishing your work is not an easier road than traditional publishing. It might seem easier, but in the long run, it isn’t if you’re expecting the same results as a traditionally published author. I believe it all evens out in the end. For the amount of work and time an author puts into starting their own self-publishing venture—if done professionally—just as much time and work could go into querying and selling a book to a bigger publisher.
I think too many writers are jumping onto the self-publishing wagon for the wrong reasons. They are either fed up with the traditional system and want to avoid all that waiting and frustration, or they think they’ll be an exception and hit it big like some of the self-publishing success stories out there. Those in the middle who do their research, take the time and money to do things professionally, and have realistic expectations, are the ones who will be happiest, I think. I’m just sad when I see someone self-publishing with any regret in their decision. It definitely needs to be something that is 100% yes!
You’ve since moved on to Rhemalda Publishing to publish Monarch. What made you decide to make the move to a traditional publisher?
Well, as I explained above, I never intended to keep self-publishing my work. If anything, I was going to self-publish two other novellas to go with Cinders, but I had no plans to self-publish anything after that, especially my longer works. I had Monarch waiting in the wings, close to querying, and when an author I had no connections to contacted me about reviewing Cinders and ended up loving the book, I looked into her traditional publisher (Rhemalda Publishing) and decided to submit Monarch to them. Small publishers had been getting some good buzz at that time with Tinkers (a novella with a small press) winning the Pulitzer prize. I thought Monarch would be a good fit with a small publisher. I was right!Did you consider trying to get an agent again to help guide you with signing a contract? If not, do you have a lawyer to handle them for you?
I did not consider getting an agent or a lawyer at that point in time, no. The author I knew with Rhemalda Publishing had hired a lawyer to look at her contract, and since we had become friends by that time, she answered a lot of questions for me. My contract was very similar and I did not feel the need to spend money on a lawyer when Rhemalda was so open to answering any questions and negotiating certain items if I wanted. I’ve talked with several other Rhemalda authors since then who have hired lawyers to go over their contract for them and not one of them has had issues or any large concerns. I’ve signed two more contracts with Rhemalda now and I’m happy with all three.
Finally, tell us about Monarch. What other projects do you have lined up with Rhemalda?
Monarch is my adult thriller about a CIA spy who’s set up for murder and has only one place to go—an old flame named Lilian Love who owns the Monarch Inn. The book is told from three points of view and centers around shooting bullets, love, lies, and of course, butterflies! You’ll have to read it to find out how that all comes about.
As far as future projects, my contemporary young adult novel, The Breakaway, comes out fall 2012 from Rhemalda. It’s about a girl who’s kidnapped by a family of jewel thieves—and she’s not sure she wants to leave them, especially the one she’s falling in love with.
Then Bonded, my collection of fairy-tale themed novellas (including Cinders) will be released from Rhemalda spring of 2013. It includes a continuation (Cinders), a retelling (Thirds), and a prequel (Scales).
I’m very excited and very happy with my career and choices so far. It has been an exciting road! Thank you for inviting me to this interview, Sarah!
***
HUGE thanks to Michelle, and to all of the featured authors this week. Also, thanks to my readers. I hope you all learned a lot this week, and see that publishing is not black or white.
I, for one, learned to let go of some of my prejudices against self-publishing. It’s not all angry rejectees and wannabe millionaires looking to “stick it to The Man.” There are real people with real talent who put in real effort to get their stories read, and isn’t that what we all do? There’s certainly room for self-publishing, indie publishing, and traditional publishing to live amongst each other. There’s no right way or wrong way; just the best way that works for you and your projects.
No blog post on Monday, but we’ll be back to our regular Story Time schedule on Wednesday. Hope you all enjoy the long weekend!
Sarah LaPolla 
This was a great series for all those non-traditional options out there and the pros and cons of each. Thanks for sharing, all!
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Great interview! I learned a lot, and I really appreciated the perspective. Thanks for doing these, Sarah!
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Jaimie: Awww, thanks! But I hope you don't get your hopes up too high. The other two novellas are companion novellas – not sequels. They still rock. Promise! I build more and more on the world.
Sierra: You're welcome! Thank you for coming by.
Anne: I didn't realize there was a lot you didn't know! Glad to share as much as I can. 🙂
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Fantastic interview! Even though I follow Michelle's blog, and she's guest-posted for me, there was a lot I didn't know about her self-publishing journey. Thanks for this!
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Thanks so much Michelle (and Sarah). I love to see agents and authors being open to self publishing as an alternative. It's really helpful to hear from someone who has traveled both roads and has such valuable insight. Great post!
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Michelle – I am very excited to hear there's more coming to Cinders. I really liked all of the characters there. I want to know what happens!
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Michael: Thank you! I certainly enjoyed writing all that detail and glad you enjoyed reading it. 🙂
Marilyn: Wow, that seems so long ago that I was first self-publishing Cinders! But it was only last year. I'm so happy you liked Cinders, and it never ceases to amaze me how many men like that book, as well! I think because it's so grown-up and has a high body count, hehehe. 🙂
Karen: You are just as awesome, m'dear!
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Michelle is awesome. That is all. 🙂
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Michelle – Fascinating interview! I loved reading about your experiences with both self-publishing and indie publishing. I was so happy when I saw Sarah’s announcement that you’d be one of the writers interviewed on her blog this week. I first met you on another agent’s blog, and did what I do for many authors – I clicked on your name to find out more about your writing. I saw that you had taken your first steps into self-publishing CINDERS at that time, I thought the book cover for CINDERS looked awesome and clicked on the book to read a sample. That’s what sold me. I remember thinking, “Wow, this is really good writing – really good writing!” … and I immediately purchased a copy. As I mentioned to you before, my husband’s a voracious reader; and, while I sank into an abyss of rewriting my own novel and had trouble finding time to read, he read CINDERS and said it was a really good book.
Sarah – I love that you said this:
“I, for one, learned to let go of some of my prejudices against self-publishing. It's not all angry rejectees and wannabe millionaires looking to 'stick it to The Man.' There are real people with real talent who put in real effort to get their stories read, and isn't that what we all do? There's certainly room for self-publishing, indie publishing, and traditional publishing to live amongst each other. There's no right way or wrong way; just the best way that works for you and your projects.”
I love how you put that! I think creative people always end up looking at the art itself much more than the ways in which it’s made accessible to the public. It’s so exciting to live in a time when we have so much access to art!
Also, I’m delighted that Michelle mentioned TINKERS. Whenever I think about the value of indie publishing, I think of TINKERS, an extraordinary indie-published book that went on to win a Pulitzer Prize for Fiction.
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Great interview Michelle. I really love Monarch and love how much detail you put into the story.
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Christa: Oh, I'm glad you don't rely on them completely. I hope no author does. I'm also glad you haven't heard any negative things about them. That's good! Thank you for your concern, too. It's good for authors to stick up for each other! 🙂
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Michelle, Thanks. I certainly don't think one source should be the be all/end all of any writer decision. And it is clear that you all are very happy with your decision and I haven't heard of anyone else saying negative things about Rhemalda so the onus seems to be on P&E to either step up and explain or pull it off the site. 🙂
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Charlie: I think every writer goes through that – realizing your writing sucks. I know I sure did when I started. It wasn't fun to realize how much more I needed to work on before I could even think about publishing!
As far as Cinders goes…there's much, much more coming. 🙂
Christa: Yes, I know about teh Preditors & Editors thing. I did an entire post about it here. No matter what Rhemalda does to fix whatever they did wrong, P&E won't pull it down. Completely lame.
All I know is that Rhemalda loves their authors and their authors love them, and I have absolutely nothing but positive things to say about them.
I sure hope you don't rely on P&E alone to steer you as a reliable source. As you can, see they aren't always correct. My advice is to always do more research than just hopping onto P&E before signing with anyone. They're a good place to start, I think.
They also don't recommend Random House.
Thanks for letting me know about Monarch! Hope you continue to enjoy the read!
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Michelle,
Preditors and Editors lists Rhemalda Publishing as “Not Recommended” with no other explanation. Were you aware of this at the time you chose to go with them? If so, did you ask them the reason before signing? If not, do you suspect the “not recommended” label is because of it being an indie publisher? It sounds like both you and Karen have had really positive experiences, but we as writers sort of count on P&E to steer us. Am curious as to your thoughts on this.
Also, I won MONARCH from Karen's blog and am really enjoying it so far!!! Thanks for sharing with us.
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Early on, I considered self-publishing because I was frustrated at the number of rejections. It later dawned on me that I received those rejections because my writing sucked. That was a clue to improve my craft, not to release garbage.
This is not the case with Ms. Argyle's work. I loved Cinders. The only disappointment was that it left me wanting more. I'm happy to learn that there's more coming. I just have to be patient and wait eighteen more months for the trilogy to be released. In the meantime, I'm gearing up for Monarch.
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Amber: Yeah, everyone's path has to be different. If there was only way to publish, we'd certainly be in a system I wouldn't even want to touch. I like flexibility. I like seeing people finding and forging new paths. I like seeing others blaze along the main path, too. Success comes in all forms.
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Jaimie: I agree that YA is not the underdog it claims to be – buy a looong shot. That went away awhile ago. The underdog seems to be adult these days, from where I stand. It sure does seem to get overlooked, so maybe it's a good thing that Cinders is perceived as YA. Higher sales. 🙂
I'm really happy that you enjoyed Cinders! It makes my day when readers let me know they loved something.
Laura: I really hope you enjoy Monarch! I think you have a good point about authors going into this informed, but from what I've seen (from emails I receive, etc.), there's more naivety than you might think. Authors seem really clueless that they're not going to sell many copies compared to their traditionally published friend with 5 books out. They also seem to underestimate the sheer amount of work that goes into it. Of course, I see this happen to anyone who publishes in any form. 🙂
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“There's certainly room for self-publishing, indie publishing, and traditional publishing to live amongst each other. There's no right way or wrong way; just the best way that works for you and your projects.”
I'm so glad to see an agent seeing the truth in the above statement!
As an author, you do what's best for your career and your project. The answer isn't the same for everyone.
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Great post. I have a copy of Monarch and can't wait to read it.
I think a lot of self publishers go into naive. But honestly, it has been such a hot topic lately that if any writer is on the blogosphere they know exactly what they are getting into. They know it's hard work and not an easy road to millions. And most writers who have self published, at least the ones I know, that go into it with realistic expectations and hire an editor and all of that are extremely happy with their decision, regardless of money.
For writers who have been writing for years and just don't fit into traditional publishing, it's a great choice.
Great series, Sarah! I loved your approach.
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There's too much of the “fantasy = YA” mindset going around right now. (re: people assuming CINDERS was YA) I'm looking forward to a resurgence in adult fantasy. YA is not really the underdog is claims to be — not in the blogosphere anyway. I love fantasy so much I want to relate to it, not my teenaged self.
Michelle, because your novella dealt with adult themes is why I thoroughly enjoyed it. It's believably “what happens after Cinderella” in that respect. The fairy-tale has grown up.
Great round of interviews this week! Very enlightening.
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